Discussing Yong Shen 論用神

[wong]

HI Relic,

Good writeup!

Anyway i have a set of bazi below.  Like to ask your opinion if it falls under those categories of determining Yong Shen you have written.  It is as below:


Ren          Gui          Xin         Yi
Zi             Hai           Si        Mao

Look forward to your opinion.

Hi acemumdo,
Regarding to the chart above,during childhood nearby house has a slope or uneven road or he may be staying in place where has staircase example
apartment

[expression]

FYI, based on ??? jianghu pai or ?? mangpai (blindman) school, they do not use Yong Shen in their readings. Yong Shen is basically a concept from Ziping school.

Hi quah,

It was said that Xu Zi Ping is the person that invented the reading of Ba Zi with day stem as the master.

Does the Mang Shi Pai also takes day stem as the master?

By the way, what is the hallmark of Jiang Hu Pai? Did they name it as such on purpose?

As far as I know when the person is referred to as Jiang Hu practitioner, it usually means they are those that set up stall on the street or wander around looking for customers. Nevertheless, I think this doesn't apply to the current world.

[Cyril]

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[Tweety]

I have the same question too.    Is Yong Shen more important than  Xi Shen?    Is Xi Shen same as favourable element?

tks

Hi,

I've some beginner questions. Hope the experts don't mind.

How useful is Yong Shen (Useful God) in reading Ba Zi?

What is the use of Yong Shen besides determining the favourable things (e.g. career etc)?

[expression]

Which country do you live? I think it is still  applicable and very much alive.

Actually, I wanted to convey that the quality of Jiang Hu practitioners are perhaps not that good nowadays compared to the ancients.

In the past, only those that are really good will become Jiang Hu practitioners though I also don't dismiss there could be few that were actually swindlers.

Nowadays, these so called Jiang Hu people are more interested in making some quick bucks and usually they are not really competent though there may be exceptions.

Anyway, these are just my personal opinions.

There is one thing that I'm sure: we very rarely or no longer get the quality and quantity of reading that the ancient practitioners did for their clients. In Malaysia which is where I am, we probably can find some good one 30-40 years ago.

[RapaNui]

How useful is Yong Shen (Useful God) in reading Ba Zi?What is the use of Yong Shen besides determining the favourable things (e.g. career etc)?

See also the topic : http://www.fivearts.net/si_zhu_ba_zi_szbz/application_of_ten_gods-t745.15.html;topicseen
 
Regards,
RapaNui - Poland

[relic]

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[Banned: acemundo]

Hi Acemundo,
-------
relic

Hi relic,

ok i understand your rationale now - which is to use only the element present in the chart. this chart is a not so typical chart and i have heard another master say the unfavourable element is EG/HO and favourable element is DO/7K.

The tricky part is that by season fire is strongest in this chart, by rootedness and parallels, fire is the strongest, while by rootedness and production cycle, wood is also very strong.  That's why for this chart, that FS master feels Eg/Ho is unfavourable but your view is that EG/HO is favorable.  another view is that this is a weak water DM chart rather than strong water DM chart.

my view is ignoring the yong shen theory of having to use only the element present in this chart, the most fav element would be earth, second favourable element should be wood if we view him as strong DM.  Nonetheless, i would be interested to hear other opinions of the favorable and unfavorable element of this chart.

by the way, there is no bing in the chart

[Banned: acemundo]

Hi acemumdo,
Regarding to the chart above,during childhood nearby house has a slope or uneven road or he may be staying in place where has staircase example
apartment

Hi heavenearth,

yes, technically you are right.  how did you arrive at this guess?

[wong]

Hi acemundo,

It's not a guess but a formula.Bazi is not a game of guess or else it will misled those who seek consultation.Bazi can help human but also can
destroy human when given wrong reading.Just like you i have done entensive studies on bazi and ziwei since young.Lately has been doing research on childhood feng shui(envoriment) if it has any effect on the birth chart regarding time and space

[Banned: acemundo]

well, maybe guess is not an appropriate word to use.  but what led you to come to this reasoning?

[wong]

Hi acemundo,

In my view,in a chart there could be more than one Yong Shen and not confine to one only.Just imagine if one has a sickness like fever, the doc
will give 2-3 type of medicine.When we look at this way,one will easily enter the door of bazi and ziwei

Regards

[wong]

Hi acemundo,

Please don't mention it
Gaining it from exprience if i have not mistaken yr question

[Banned: acemundo]

Hi acemundo,

Please don't mention it
Gaining it from exprience if i have not mistaken yr question

Hi heavenearth,

specifically, what are the factors you noted from this bazi that prompt you to say that he lives in an apartment when young?

[Banned: acemundo]

Hi acemundo,

In my view,in a chart there could be more than one Yong Shen and not confine to one only.Just imagine if one has a sickness like fever, the doc
will give 2-3 type of medicine.When we look at this way,one will easily enter the door of bazi and ziwei

Regards

Hi heavenearth,

I do agree.  So what's your view on the favorable and unfavorable element of the set of bazi i posted?

[relic]

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[Banned: acemundo]

Hi Relic,

sorry, i shld hv been more clear.  Bing is not in the HS but in the HHS would not be able to combine right?  or you are referring to 暗合 ？

actually, no, the master said that shishang is a negative element, not a positive element.

My preference goes to guan element in this case.  My consideration is as follow

1) Balance the DM element (since it is strong i want to weaken it)
2) Balance the chart as a whole (being summer season, Fire is the strongest)

As such, i feel that Guan element achieves both objective well ie weaken fire and counter water.  the second favorable element is still something debatable as the reasons for choosing either shishang or cai are not overwhelming.

[wong]

Hi heavenearth,

specifically, what are the factors you noted from this bazi that prompt you to say that he lives in an apartment when young?

Hi ace,
The interaction of Tian and Di.It's quite  complicated to explain in a few words

[wong]

Hi heavenearth,

I do agree.  So what's your view on the favorable and unfavorable element of the set of bazi i posted?

Hi ace,

Base on the birth chart only,i will consider Xin before age 32 and Ren after
If on a whole chart view,i will use Ren

[expression]

specifically, what are the factors you noted from this bazi that prompt you to say that he lives in an apartment when young?

Hi acemundo,

Someone mentioned in another forum that a Taiwan 4Ps teacher called Song Yin Chen revealed a method to predict one's physical environment at birth decades ago. Perhaps you can try to look for Song's books in shop though I ain't sure whether Song has written any books or not.